Anitique China & Fine China Query - Japanese tea set or not?

by Charmaine
(Florida)

Antique China & Fine China Query - Japanese tea set or not?

Great website...

As a child we went to visit an aunt and she gave us 2 china tea sets to play with. My mom snatched the sets away from us and told my aunt they were too beautiful for kids to play with.

I always had my eye on one of the sets and when she moved she gave me the Japanese one. I actually don't know if it's real Japanese but it has a teapot and small cups & a creamer and sugar bowl. What's interesting to me is the beautiful pattern, it has dragons on it and there is no marking but when you hold the delicate cup to light there is a image of a Japanese lady's face.

So I suspect it is bone china and Japanese because of the face and that light shines through the china when you hold it up to a light.

Charmaine

Reply from Peter (admin) below - just scroll down


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Reply by Peter (admin)

To:- Antique China & Fine China Query - Japanese tea set or not?

Hi Charmaine

Lovely story, thanks for sharing! And thanks for your comments about the website.

First thing to say is how lovely the set sounds - with the face of the Japanese girl and all.

Second thing is, it would have been nice to see some photos. It would assist me if visitors were to upload a clear picture of the back pottery marks as well as one of the item itself. As the system only allows one photo to be uploaded per submission form, the best thing to do is merge your photos into one single image.

(If you're not sure what I mean by a merged photo, have a look at this excellent example. If you don't know how to merge photos, use my photo-merge service).

Third, I have to say my knowledge of Japanese wares is not so good, so I suggest you drop in on the oriental experts at Gotheborg.com, or call in the cavalry by getting a professional appraisal.

On my 'Liaise With The Experts' page you can get in touch with a specialist appraiser who should be able to tell you a whole lot more about your wares. You don't have to pay any money upfront to use this unique service, and I've designed it especially to protect my visitors from wasting time and money online.

I'm really sorry I can't help more, Charmaine. That said, I do love stories like this as they make great reading - many thanks.

Best regards

Peter (admin)
www.figurinecollect.com (These pages show our new English made bone china figurine collection)
www.figurines-sculpture.com (This is my bigger site covering all aspects of fine china making)

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Comments for
Anitique China & Fine China Query - Japanese tea set or not?

Click here to add your own comments

child's dragon teaset
by: tonyy

The 'Japanese' teaset would not be bone china as that is not a ceramic body associated with Japan. But it could be egg-shell porcelain which they are famous for. I agree with Peter - a photo would really help identify it.
Mystery solved - Japanese tea set or not Query - "Geisha" porcelain
by: Charmaine

Hi Peter,

Thank you so much for directing me to the Gotheborg website on the Japanese tea set or not Query.

I found the set almost similar to mine under the title" 1924 Cherry Blossom Marks" except mine has no markings but the Japanese lady that comes to life when the cup is held to a light source as demonstrated in the picture.

It is really a piece of art and I wonder how they were able to emboss it at that time. (They did not have laser technology ; ) ) I now suspect that it's is earlier than 1920's because I failed to mention that my childhood was in South Africa and the set must have been imported during the Dutch/West Indies period. I am thrilled!!

Thank you,

Charmaine

=============================

Further comment by Peter (admin)

Thanks for this great update Charmaine. What a great story! I would love to know the technology involved in the embossing too. I will ask around my more technically minded colleagues. meantime if anyone else has any ideas, please post a comment here.

Visitor Rod (see above comments) has stumbled across a similar set which he has researched on Gotheborg and feels it might even be older than yours. He requested your email to contact you. I have no objection to this, and don't mind visitors using these pages to talk to one another but recommend you don't publish your email addresses online as they can tend to become victim of the horrible 'Spam Bots' who search the net for victims to send stupid unsolicited emails to.

Instead, use my contact form (see the left side nav bar on most pages)to contact me direct and I will forward the initial emails and you can take it from there. PLEASE MAKE SURE TO CROSS REFERENCE THE TITLE OF THE EMAIL AS "Geisha Porcelain - Japanese tea set or not Query", otherwise it may get lost in the system (I often have 200 emails and submissions waiting to be sorted.)

Thanks again, Charmaine, for enhancing the site with your contributions.

Best regards

Peter (admin)
"Geisha" porcelain - dragon/lady's face Japanese tea set
by: Rod

Hi Peter and Charmaine

I stumbled across a set of this very beautiful china (?) just today. One of the pieces (not a cup or saucer) had the stamp on its base of an S in 5 triangles as shown and described in Gotheborg's under Japan China #35 between Rozuki and SPP. Of course this sign had no further clarification.

Should you have more info, wish to buy, or would like more info from me I would love to share this with the lady who has this set. Rather than take up Peter's space further, he is welcome to share my email address with you for this purpose.

I apologize, Peter, for using your space for this. I just happened across your site and then had the audacity to make this outrageous request.

My interest is 19th and early 20th century American stoneware crocks; consequently I am tirelessly searching for origins of a number of marked, but unidentified, utilitarian stoneware pieces. That is how I wandered from the path to your driveway.

Thanks ever so much.

Rod
"Geisha" porcelain - Dragon/lady's face Japanese Tea Set (Charmaine)
by: Rod

Hi Peter,

Sorry for the interruption for yet another comment for Charmaine (April 2, 2009)and also for your information. Further research leads me to further identify Charmaine's tea set as being known or referred to as "Geisha" porcelain.

Between your info about dating these pieces and Gotheborg's information (Gotheborg.com - under section titled "Antique Japanese Porcelain Q & A" - subsection "Geisha Girl Dragonware" and - subsection "Geisha" seen when held up against the light) it would appear that Charmaine's tea set would have been made post 1941, since my pieces show the "S" Triangles symbol described in my earlier note to you with the words "Made in Japan" beneath the symbol.

Also Gotheborg suggests that this may have originated in the Kutani and/or Arita factories; however, the "S" triangles marking might refute that.

I would like to see your response to these comments for my info. Would I see that in your blog, an email, or your newsletter? Thanks. Rod

BTW the info is free.

===========================

Further Comment by Peter (admin)

Rod

Thanks for sharing your great research on these Japanese tea sets. Also thanks for giving permission to use your info elsewhere on the site etc. Much appreciated.

I really don't know about Japanese pottery marks so can't comment more about the Kutani and/or Arita factory marks, but would appreciate any visitor posting more info on the subject.

You obviously have a real eye for detail.

I have posted a comment to Charmaine (see below) to suggest I can forward on visitors emails to each other if required.

You sound quite an authority on early 20th century American stoneware crocks. I like the way you describe finding this site as "wandered from the path to your driveway". Although this site deals mostly with fine china rather than studio pottery or stoneware, please consider uploading an article or two on your collection as it is not totally unconnected.

Best regards and thanks again

Peter (admin)
'Geisha tea set'
by: Malcolm from Cambs UK

Hi, sorry to go back to Charmaine's story about the tea set but I believe I also have something similar.

It was given to me by my father who always said he bought it at the end of WW2.

It is a white china tea set with silver Japanese style drawings. When you hold the tea cup to the light you can see the face of a Japanese lady.

I have always wanted to know more about this set. It is really interesting to hear that others have similar sets too.

Thank you
Japaese tea set or not?
by: Debbie

Charmaine I have the same tea set but only 5 cups and only 1 with the face in the base. The markings on the other cups/tea pot etc is Cherry China. Mine also came to me from a great aunt
japanese tea set
by: Anonymous

I acquired about 18 months ago a set of cups and saucers which have the geisha face in the bottom and the dragon around cups and saucers, these are japanese dragon lithopanes and are made of egg shell porcelain, mine are in orange, white and rich brown, i have seen some in browns and white, blue and white as well.
Japanese Giesha Face China
by: JapanFan

Hi,
I was randomly looking up things in google when i came across this post.
I have 2 sets for the egg-shell china "Giesha face" tea set, and my mum has 2 as well.
We each have a coffee and a tea styled set.

3 of these sets were bought by my dad during his visits to Japan. All from the same manufacturer in a small plaza in Osaka. During his last visit in 2003 the old man sadly told him that he was no longer going to make them because younger generations wouldn't learn the skills required and weren't interested in buying tea-sets anymore.

1. Mums coffee set was bought brand new during 1976
2 & 3. Were bought in 2003 and were the last two complete sets in the store.

My last set is pre- WW1, compared to the others the egg-shell is magnificent, hardly 1mm thick, while the 2003 variety are 2mm thick.
The 24 carat gold leaf coverage and quality is lacking in the later models.
Also the faces vary between the different years as well.

Hope this helps someone.

=======================================

Peter (admin) says:

What a fantastic contribution! People like you make this website tick. Can't thank you enough for taking the trouble - nice karma!
Such please small things doth make...
by: Charmaine

Hi Peter & friends,

I learned a lot from all the comments and visiting the sites re the Japanese set. I am still intrigued by the embossing. How did the Geisha end up at the bottom of the teacup? I did ceramics & pottery myself and I learned to make imprints but the Geisha is two toned.

Looking forward from hearing from you.

Thanks,
Charmaine
Moms china!
by: Anonymous

If one has a set of china with a Lady in the bottom of the cup, what would one do with this set??? please email me @ letrbuck@hotmail.com
34 PEICE JAPANESE TEA SET
by: EDDIE

my wife's mother died in 1936 the tea set was left for my wife it must be at least 75 year old
of the nine cups with geisha girl 4 are broken but still together in all the set has 34 pieces
Geisha girl Japanese tea and coffee set
by: eddie legge

My wife says the 34 piece Japanese set I mentioned was originally a tea and coffee set
We do not believe it is of any value money wise having been told it is made of Japanese egg shell porcelain and they were brought into the country in large numbers. My wife lost her mother at birth Oct 1936 the set must be at least 75 years old.

The sentimental value shall be lost after our days
We have 3 children 5 grand children and 3 great grand children who not are not interested in this wonderful work of art
tea set
by: kenn MacAskill (UK)

Hello and how informative your site is thank you,
I have a tea set as described with face in bottom of the cups I have set of 6cups 6saucers 6side plates, tea pot, milk jug, sugar bowl,all with the dragon design, the dragons are all slightly different in colours and look like they were handmade and just laid on when wet, on the bottom of the set apart from the cups the mark on mine is CHH over CHINA in red surrounded by Asian looking Laural leaf with what appears to be a cherry blossom flower in the middle top.
I was given mine in 1977 in the UK by a friend who knew i liked Asian things, She told me her father brought it back from the far east after the war, I was just interested in finding out a bit more about it and i came across your site so thank you again and hope the little bits i have added to this forum helps,
PS, am still researching the CHH CHINA mark and will let you know if i find anything else . regards kenn
Japanese Giesha Face China @ Kenn/Eddie
by: JapanFan

@Kenn
Your china is Dragon Ware. Giesha Girl china doesnt have any marking on the bottom other than the face, from the 10+ sets i have seen.
@Eddie
Your set sounds alot like what my mum has. its a matching tea and coffee set with side plates aswell. If your family does care for it, take it to a second hand wares shop, and fetch a penny for it now. Dont waste it on them.

These are a dying art form and should be cared for, if that means selling them to a collector for them to be treasured and preserved.
Even if some are gimicky trinkets brought home by soldiers, they are still artifacts of our history.
Just look at how much some people are paying for old McDonalds toys.
I have my own set!
by: Sam

http://www.figurines-sculpture.com/japanese-bone-china-gold-dragons-21-piece-tea-set.html

I submitted my own story to the site, and you can find it at the above link. It includes pictures of one of the saucers (a gold and red dragon) and the Lady's face that appears on the bottom of the cup. You have to hold the cup to the light in order to see it - we held it over a lamp for the picture and were looking into the cup.

We have 21 pieces in all. Six cups, plates, and saucers, plus a tea pot, a creamer, and what we think is a sugar bowl (I'm unsure if it had a sprout or not). They all match, for they all have the same dragon print that is in the photo. All the saucers have the same mark on the bottom, which I believe to be from the company "Nichi Hon".

My grandmother believed that the face on the bottom of the cup was not a geisha, but the Emperor's wife - although we were unsure if it would be the Kogo or not. For those who do not know, the Kogo is the first wife of the Emperor who leads all the other wives.

Please look into it? =] We really want to get it dated at the very least. I'll be looking into the China Cultural Center here in Phoenix, Arizona as soon as I can (Senior year of High school starts soon, so I'm very busy!).
My dad has a dragon tea set
by: Anonymous

He was in Malaysia in the 50's (UK National Service) and bought it there, shipped it home to his mum. It cost him a few dollars, but i've seen one valued at 475 usd.

His is blue background with dragon in red with white dots. the cups do have a japanese style womans face in the bottom.

he said there was another set when he bought his that had the face set to the back of the cup rather than underneath.

Hope this helps.
Geisha Girl Tea Set
by: Anonymous

I have the same tea set! I have 16 tea cups with sausers and there is a geisha girl in the bottom of the cup - I also have the teapot, sugar and creamer plus other pieces that match it. It is white with green and gold dragons and rimmed in gold. It was my Grandmothers and she brought it (plus several other sets) back from when my Grandfather was stationed in Japan. My Mother has a full chinet set - plates, salad plates, teapot and cups with sausers and it is actually stamped "made in occupied Japan" - we have always wondered what the value of our sets were! If anyone has any idea please email me at danjenb@gmail.com! Thanks!

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